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Post by doc11 on Feb 21, 2014 18:34:54 GMT
I don't know if I read this properly, you are saying that my buddy is a bench shooter? I think we need to have a conversation about what all those things I listed mean....!
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Post by NamelessStain on Feb 21, 2014 19:44:02 GMT
I don't know if I read this properly, you are saying that my buddy is a bench shooter? I think we need to have a conversation about what all those things I listed mean....!  (notice the blue text, it means I'm joking) |
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Post by doc11 on Mar 3, 2014 17:53:51 GMT
Riiiight.
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Post by NamelessStain on Mar 13, 2014 18:23:15 GMT
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Post by Browning35 on Mar 14, 2014 4:26:02 GMT
Damn, that fucker's big.
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Post by LowKey on Aug 2, 2014 16:53:16 GMT
Alright, let's throw this out there-
My new home is in coastal Alaska, which means people in heavy clothing and lots of very large bears...and these bears aren't as shy as the ones in the lower 48.
Now imagine you're out in the forest with an AR-15 chambered in 5.56 and you get charged by a 1000+ pound bear. How do you foresee that playing out?
Sometimes size will matter.
Personally I'm toying with the idea of an AR10 (due to the ergonomics)chambered in something like .450 Marlin.
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Post by NamelessStain on Aug 2, 2014 17:42:25 GMT
How big do you think you're going to need?
458 SOCOM? Just a barrel and buffer away. You can even reuse your .223 mags. Rounds are expensive as hell, but once you get above .308 it seems all the prices get crazy.
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Post by LowKey on Aug 2, 2014 23:42:27 GMT
How big do you think you're going to need? Big Enough to deal with one of these if I get charged while out in the woods. Don't get me wrong I'm not of the opinion that bears commonly lie in wait for humans, but try to keep in mind that there are A LOT of bears on the island....it's not like the lower 48 where they are less densely populated. I'm also not talking about hunting the bears. That's a different kettle of fish and the caliber/rifle combinations for that have a different criteria. Put it this way....in the highly unlikely circumstances that you're doing something "tactical"  with a 5.56 AR out in the woods and you get attacked by one of these critters how well do you think 5.56 is going to do at preventing it from chewing on you? *EDITED TO ADD* Both AR15's in .458 SOCOM and the AR10 I've seen that's chambered in .450 Marlin both have a depressingly low magazine capacity (drum mags can raise the SOCOM's round count, but talk about awkward to carry extra mags!). If I had the time to tinker I'd be tempted to try fabricating a scaled up version of an AR mag to create a stick mag that would hold in the 20-30 round range, but that would require a chop job on a lower to blow out the sides of the mag well (not that I have a problem with that), or maybe picking up the unicorn gear Hydra AR lower and fab a new magwell for it. Obviously I have delusions of being Tony Stark....tell me again why I'm not rich?             |
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Post by dannusmaximus on Aug 3, 2014 1:24:20 GMT
Alright, let's throw this out there- My new home is in coastal Alaska, which means people in heavy clothing and lots of very large bears...and these bears aren't as shy as the ones in the lower 48. Now imagine you're out in the forest with an AR-15 chambered in 5.56 and you get charged by a 1000+ pound bear. How do you foresee that playing out? Sometimes size will matter. Personally I'm toying with the idea of an AR10 (due to the ergonomics)chambered in something like .450 Marlin. I think if you're being charged by 1/2 ton of pissed off Ursus, nothing that isn't crew served and/or vehicle mounted is going to drop them in time to keep you from getting killed... |
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Post by Browning35 on Aug 3, 2014 2:27:43 GMT
A standard 30 rd 5.56 mag holds 10 .458 Socom rds.
I don't know anything about bear charges so feel free to correct me, the ones I've seen have been running away from us.
However I've been charged by hogs and dogs before and trying to dump 10 rds of a higher recoiling caliber would be tough time limitation-wise before they reached you. So I mean is a higher cap mag past 10 rds really needed?
Or do they charge from farther away or something up there? I only know about black bear, not brown, griz or polar bears.
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Post by LowKey on Aug 3, 2014 2:43:07 GMT
Alright, let's throw this out there- My new home is in coastal Alaska, which means people in heavy clothing and lots of very large bears...and these bears aren't as shy as the ones in the lower 48. Now imagine you're out in the forest with an AR-15 chambered in 5.56 and you get charged by a 1000+ pound bear. How do you foresee that playing out? Sometimes size will matter. Personally I'm toying with the idea of an AR10 (due to the ergonomics)chambered in something like .450 Marlin. I think if you're being charged by 1/2 ton of pissed off Ursus, nothing that isn't crew served and/or vehicle mounted is going to drop them in time to keep you from getting killed... Common wisdom in the area says larger caliber rifles firing projectiles with a high SD (sectional density) work. Shoulder shots to slow the bears charge are suggested if you can remember in the heat of the moment (or heat of the bowel movement as the case may be). I do however echo your sentiment. Definitely an occasion for a BFG. |
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Post by LowKey on Aug 3, 2014 3:02:52 GMT
A standard 30 rd 5.56 mag holds 10 .458 Socom rds. I don't know anything about bear charges so feel free to correct me, the ones I've seen have been running away from us. However I've been charged by hogs and dogs before and trying to dump 10 rds of a higher recoiling caliber would be tough time limitation-wise before they reached you. So I mean is a higher cap mag past 10 rds really needed? Or do they charge from farther away or something up there? I only know about black bear, not brown, griz or polar bears. Browning, those ARE black bears. They just get very very very large on the island. Has to do with a very plentiful all you can eat buffet of salmon, deer, and berries. I doubt I'd get off more than 10 rounds without a giggle switch*, frankly I doubt I'll get off more than 3 or 4 even if I'm lucky. The difficulty is trying to figure out a caliber/rifle combination that would handle a defensive shoot vs one of the local (very large) charging black bears and yet still be very viable for (puke)tactical **work. I don't expect a need to pretend I'm in my early 20's and in uniform again, but it would suck ass to grab my 5.56 AR and go check the proverbial noise in the shed/boathouse/greenhouse and aggravate a bear who's decided that they want to break in. Likewise it would suck to be toting a lever action 45-70 and discover at close range 3-4 meth heads stealing my stuff. I need the penetration of the heavier calibers to really have a chance of being effective against an attacking big bear. I want/need the larger mag capacity if I have to deal with 2 legged attackers. I'm just glad bears aren't pack hunters  Of should I just get a freakin' flamethrower? 
*I already have a couple of SBR's and suppressors, and e-forms make things much easier, but I'm not quite ready to plunk down the $ needed to buy and feed full auto toys.
** I really hate the word "tactical". It conjures up the image of mall ninjas and Gecko's, but it also encompasses what you're doing if you have to go poking about looking for possible bad guy. Not a lot of LE on the island, and response time is measured in hours or days depending on your exact location.
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Post by Browning35 on Aug 3, 2014 4:08:18 GMT
Lol...yeah, I realize those are black bears (thanks though). Just never seen them do anything except exit stage right when they see a human down here. So I was unsure if you were more worried about browns or griz since they're a lot larger and more aggressive than the ones you were showing.
That's all I was saying though about the number of shots. Either the charge gets busted up in 2-3 shots or they reach you by that time anyway.
(A flamethrower would get you points for style and originality, but would be friggin heavy and you might burn down half the forest.)
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(notice the blue text, it means I'm joking)
with a 5.56 AR out in the woods and you get attacked by one of these critters how well do you think 5.56 is going to do at preventing it from chewing on you? 
